Conspiracy - it helps to understand before buying in...

www.abc.net.au/news/2025-02-02/jfk-documents-trump-conspiracy-theories/104875274

To whom it may concern: please don't lock or move this thread to the Dumpster, 'cause I'm going to relate this to photography in a very long rant about (yes, you may well have guessed it!) Equivalence. 😁

Now, before I begin my rant, I want to say up front that, despite my history on DPR, I don't really care about Equivalence at all -- I just try to take the best photos I can with the camera in hand. But I do very much enjoy knowing how and why things work they way they do and I very much do care about is willful ignorance. The whole mess the US is in today was foreshadowed almost precisely by the way the "Equivalence Wars" played out on DPR.

OK, so I googled the following: "why do people believe conspiracies but deny provable facts" and got the following AI response, which I very much agree with:

People might believe conspiracies while denying provable facts due to a combination of psychological factors including a need to feel in control, a distrust of authority, cognitive biases that encourage pattern recognition, social pressures, and a desire to maintain their existing worldview, often leading them to selectively interpret information that aligns with their beliefs and dismiss evidence that contradicts them; this can be especially prevalent when facing complex or uncertain situations.

Key points about why people might believe conspiracies:

Sense of Control:

Conspiracy theories can provide a sense of understanding and control in situations that feel chaotic or uncertain, allowing individuals to believe they have "inside knowledge" about events, even if that knowledge is not based on facts.

Distrust in Authority:

A deep distrust of institutions or powerful figures can make people more susceptible to believing that these entities are actively concealing information, leading them to seek alternative explanations.

Cognitive Biases:

Humans naturally seek patterns and connections, which can sometimes lead to misinterpreting random events as part of a larger conspiracy.

Confirmation Bias:

People tend to focus on information that confirms their existing beliefs while dismissing evidence that contradicts them, reinforcing their conspiracy theories.

Social Influence:

When surrounded by others who believe in a conspiracy, individuals might be more likely to adopt those beliefs due to social pressure or a desire to fit in.

Motivated Reasoning:

People can be motivated to interpret information in a way that supports their desired conclusion, especially when it aligns with their political or ideological views.

One important factor that was not included in the list is the Dunning-Kruger Effect (you can Google it if you don't know about it). Now, to be sure, no one is immune to all of the above (except me, obviously 😁). We're all on a spectrum which varies significantly based on a huge number of factors. For example, one of the more problematic of the Equivalence Deniers (who, in the end, after coming to understand that what "we" were saying was, in fact, correct) actually wrote, "I don't even care if they're right anymore -- they're just annoying and should be banned."

And that's what the mods did, in fact, do -- they banned the "annoying" people who were correct, because, well, the willfully ignorant were annoyed at constantly being corrected. Imagine a group of people in a church constantly interrupting the preacher by pointing out inconsistencies and inaccuracies in the Bible that contradict their sermon. Imagine if every MAGA person were fact-checked everytime they opened their mouth or posted something. But we don't have to really imagine, we can simply look at any number of posts when an mFT enthusiast was told that, no, their 25 / 1.4 was not equivalent to a 50 / 1.4 on FF, but rather a 50 / 2.8 on FF. And you don't have to imagine how much worse it got as they dug their hole (with help from others, no less!) faster than "we" could give them shovels.

Now, does Equivalence actually matter? Does the fact that the Earth is a sphere, tilted at 23.4°, that rotates about its axis once per day, and orbits the Sun once per year, matter? Well, not in the normal course of most people's lives (and never in the life of a Flat Earther). But it does matter if you want to understand why there are seasons, why the plane flies near the Aleutian Islands and Kamchatka from San Diego to Tokyo, etc., etc., etc..

Equivalence is the same deal, and the deniers all exhibit the same kinds of extreme behavior as conspiracy theorists. And, as everyone in the US is realizing (or is about to find out), yeah, the facts do matter. And when it all goes wrong, doubling down on ignorance, as opposed to righting yourself, is the absolute worst course of action to take.

Hopefully, this saves your thread. Or did I just dig the hole deeper? 😉

We sure need some urgent research on why people believe conspiracy theories. Democracy is at stake.

Some further thoughts.
Ever since tobacco became a target of science and legislation, there has been a major campaign to destroy trust in Science. It has worked.
Check "The Triumph of Doubt" by David Michaels. Also check his credentials. he's been in the right places at the right time to know what he's talking about. He is excellent at showing how "doubt" has been used to undermine science and create fear from politicians to prevent them acting on scientific evidence. There's now a whole mega industry whose services can be purchased (including peer review science journals) to "cast doubt" and undermine science.

Then there is the role of media. In the USA in particular, Fox news (and its Australian owner Murdoch) should be held to account. Roger Ailes convinced Murdoch that there was money to be made by running a media outlet that told those on the right what they wanted to hear. Fox has been brilliantly successful at it. Fox has destroyed traditional journalism ethics and opened up the world of alternative facts. They have played a large part in destroying trust in the traditional channels of information in the name of "free speech."

Then there is the role of religion in the USA. I can only shake my head in incredulity on this one but the consequences seem to run through every aspect of USA life.

Well first off, I don't know why the thread needed saving. It was an article that hopefully helps some people from falling down the conspiracy hole.
And we are on DPRevived not DPR, so as long as the admins are not also conspiracy theorists, I think we are safe... 😉

I have met the odd one. And as much as reading about them and their beliefs is odd, it is something else (for a STEM type person) to sit there and listen to what they believe, and observe how, to justify their beliefs, they continually grab at the next more implausible idea. Just for example, the latest one I met was a flat earther. I never really thought anyone could be brain washed to that extent and it was all I could do to hold my composure (stop my jaw from dropping indicating I thought I talking to a complete looney tunes - but she saw enough signs to read that anyway, and as are all good conspiracy theorists, she came well prepared with responses). To my observation that you don't have to go up a very high hill to see the earth's curvature, I received a well rehearsed response about optical illusion and the one that ALL pilots know it's not true but they can't say it through fear of losing their jobs. Then came the lie that she had met 3 pilots who confirmed it for her. And on and on - no real answer to great circle paths - not enough grey matter to understand those...

It was interesting to link your issue with equivalence deniers (would be my issue too but I haven't got caught in that one and with your help will hopefully avoid it) with conspiracy theorists and there is of course equivalence (pun intended) in intelligence, grey matter function, belief systems, etc, between both camps.

My observation of that whole thing on DPR is that the problem for those who try to state facts is the Complaint Button. The deniers have that sort of personality that they hammer away on that little button while the rational do not. The mods, whether smart enough to understand the discussion or not, and not smart enough to understand that it is the complainers who are the problem, are sort of bound to sin bin the messenger... Something that has had parallels in history over the eons and that can be observed becoming more prevalent as the mass of the great unwashed grows... I blame sedentary, easy lifestyle, poor food and media content. To me this all started many decades ago once tv and jock strap presenters became the norm. Sure computer games, mobile phones, fb, twitter all contribute, but its roots go back a long way to when media and marketing companies realised they could influence behaviour for their benefit, with no consideration of the long term effects on society in general.

TBC?

All true but just a quick fact check there.

Part of the deal of Murdoch taking over Fox was that he had to become a USA citizen. So we can properly wipe our hands of him and continue to consider that our country would never produce such a person... 😁