I don‘t have any personal experience with it, but it might be true that there‘s too much emotion/conflict attached to sensor sizes and their differences to use that as dividing lines.
I don‘t fully get the notion of "but I only want to read about brand XY" etc. but because it is about gear it probably makes sense to have unique distinctions there even if they are somewhat inconsistent. A "Third party lenses" sub does only make sense when everything is divided by brands as well. A solution like that might be an acceptable compromise for most, I‘d assume!
Good grief- quite the hissy fit and storming off in a huff like an attention seeking infant. Get a grip, and calm down girl!
While you are pouting, contemplate whether this is the type of moderation needed here: www.dpreview.com/forums/post/67128502
Totally unnecessary and typical of the nonsense moderation going on there. We don't need that over here on this site.
... and just as I've tried to make a case for giving everyone a chance and stressed that you actually didn't insult EdShapiro in this thread, you deem a response like this a good fit.
Some fierce proponents of free speech do not understand real principles behind freedom of speech - they think that this includes also freedom to insult and attack everyone. One may only hope that they will grow up eventually, until that it is likely the easiest (but not always the best) way to simply ignore them.
You got it wrong! I am not angry and storming off, I am just disappointed and leaving quietly. I am not seeking attention, especially from you. Infantile? Name-calling," hissy-fit, calling a man a girl? Kindergaten stuff. I am not insulted- I used the wrong word- I am disgusted!
Typical online troll. You don't know me, who I am, waht I do, and waht I have to offer. I am just a faceless name on a website. I made no reference to the old DPR forum- never had a moderation issue there.
When you say "we", do you speak for everyone on this site? If so, you certainly don't need me aroundd here.
Good grief- quite the hissy fit and storming off in a huff like an attention-seeking infant. Get a grip, and calm down girl!
While you are pouting, contemplate whether this is the type of moderation needed here: www.dpreview.com/forums/post/67128502
Totally unnecessary and typical of the nonsense moderation going on there. We don't need that over here on this site.
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You got it wrong! I am not angry and storming off, I am just disappointed and leaving quietly. I am not seeking attention, especially from you. Infantile? Name-calling," hissy-fit, calling a man a girl? Kindergaten stuff. I am not insulted- I used the wrong word- I am disgusted!
Typical online troll. You don't know me, who I am, waht I do, and waht I have to offer. I am just a faceless name on a website. I made no reference to the old DPR forum- never had a moderation issue there.
When you say "we", do you speak for everyone on this site? If so, you certainly don't need me aroundd here.
[/quote]
So what do you 'suggest' in terms of moderation Ed? Common sense suggestions outside the usual no threatening behaviour or porn, or any of the other stuff we can all agree on.
Where do you draw the line as to what is not acceptable for all? Free speech, non inclusiveness, off-topic, shackling the first amendment, etc..etc..?
I would look for ways to engage the audience beyond the give & take of an exchange of text posts on a forum. For example, schedule photographers to make presentations on YouTube, Zoom or another platform. Those could range from 45-minute talks by a photographer of some standing with Q&A at the end to short 5-minute presentations by...anybody...on a photo they recently made and, possibly, a technique they used to get the shot, and anything in-between.
Offer constructive critique sessions. It might be one photographer's photo that gets critiqued or it might be a longer session during which several submitted photos are critiqued. If it's constructive and focused on helping photographers grow, people will submit their photos or participate with constructive commentary.
Schedule occasional events in which one or a few topics are presented for discussion by a host plus 1 or 2 guests with live Q&A by the audience. You could kick up some sand on the beach and probably find a few folks with opinions to share on AI 😉
There are a variety of ways this could be taken. I'm sure others would have some creative fun input in this regard. One of the goals, of course, would be to schedule or host events that aren't time-intensive for you or the hosts. Keep it relatively simple, casual, fun...and manageable. If four types of events are scheduled each month - presentation, critique, topical discussion, an "Open Mic" during which members share a photo or two - that would average one type of event per week with no more than one-a-month for any specific event.
As with most advice, mine is freely offered. The cost is in the taking and following of it.
So, back on topic: If a majority of people here prefers some form of the first (brand based) approach of the gear section, is it possible to get a "Third party and adapted lenses" sub or something to the effect? What do others think - modern third party lenses outside of the big manufacturers (like Laowa, TTartisan etc.) might fit in nicely with older lenses for the most part, right?
Some great ideas in there! 👍 I have no clue if any of the people from the current team are able to produce anything like that, particularly on a regular schedule, but if it's indeed possible to make it "relatively simple, casual, fun" as you suggested, it could be a good addition.
I basically agree with Robert .. Looking at DPR the conversations were generally based and carried on by tribes, members who associated with those with a similar interest -- Camera Silos and Photo Threads. .. and generally having had those associations for years .... With photographs the C&C and 4/3rds Weekly thread are examples .. They had been active for more than a decade in the same 4/3rds Forum over on DPR and in recent years members rarely participated in both... When they moved here both received a sub-forum. .. C&C has maintained the Weekly thread and little conversation goes on in the sub-forum outside that thread. It seems to continue to work well. .. The 4/3 Weekly tried to convert the sub-forum into a substitute for the Weekly thread and seems to have failed as members felt uncomfortable with that and have mostly returned to DPR and a Weekly Thread ...
However this is Your Forum and if you want to change the discussion I look forward to how it goes .... For my interests I may have to return to the 4/3rds tribe! . ... It takes time to join and be accepted into another Internet tribe ..... and I'm getting older ...
Bill, some good ideas - we will take a serious look at doing things like that.
Simplejoy, yes, we will not exclude 'adapted lenses' or similar, no matter what the outcome.
Whynot, whether we have a M4.3 forum or split into camera brands, we will always have people who won't want to join in - or will prefer other places. But we want to develop DPRevived as more than a collection of forums (see Billis ideas above) so we hope that that will attract people here and they will stay.
Stig, if you can't be civil, please don't bother to post.
Good question. However, if you believe PetaPixel genera covers it better. petapixel.com/black-and-white-photography-guide/#:~:text=The%20medium%20earned%20its%20position,both%20film%20and%20digital%20cameras.
Leica has produced B&W versions of their digital cameras starting with the M9. Pentax now produces a B&W digital camera. Of course one can still get black and white film in all sizes up to 16x20 sheet film. The movie Oppenheimer is shot in both color and black and white to separate the dichotomy that was his life and deeds. The movie, "The Last Picture Show" would not be on the Library of Congress' list of most significant films if the story were told using color film. The only reason I asked is that it was removed from its current location and did not appear anyplace else as if it was totally being eliminate as a forum topic.
The genre of B&W is restricted by its monochrome nature with only tonality, form and texture to define it. To me Black and White is to important and too unique a medium and topic to be eliminated from the forum as a discussion topic.
It will ultimately be up to you admins to decide how fast and how much to compress the sections, and in what way. That most of the current membership came from DPR is a significant factor. Brand based division is familiar, and it is possible to make too many users overly uncomfortable with new ways of dividing things. But unless you do want to compete with DPR on gear reviews and discussion, you'll need to find ways to make users more comfortable participating in a broader set of activities and discussions, including those that cross brand-lines. The good news is that it is already happening and you have a great tool for facilitating it: the Threads view.
If you look at the most active threads in this forum with 100+posts, there are patterns: photo sharing and discussion threads, technical discussions like the one on exposure, topic-based non brand discussions like the ones on pre-visualization and AI, discussion about forum structure, and of course general arguments and complaints. In the second tier of active threads, with 25-100 responses, are a lot of really good threads that are in these same categories. Thread development and support are skills, and we have some members who are obviously good at this, so that is something that can be developed further in a purposeful way to help build interaction that is not limited to equipment.
And we all look forward to seeing what else you guys develop. I think there are more experts here than you may realize, and many of them would contribute engaging articles. Bill Ferris's ideas are great and would probably interest a number of folks, since video is far more popular a medium now than forums. (I'm a forum gal, but I acknowledge I'm a minority).
Thanks for allowing us the opportunity to share our ideas.
You got it wrong! I am not angry and storming off, I am just disappointed and leaving quietly. I am not seeking attention, especially from you. Infantile? Name-calling," hissy-fit, calling a man a girl? Kindergaten stuff. I am not insulted- I used the wrong word- I am disgusted!
Typical online troll. You don't know me, who I am, waht I do, and waht I have to offer. I am just a faceless name on a website. I made no reference to the old DPR forum- never had a moderation issue there.
When you say "we", do you speak for everyone on this site? If so, you certainly don't need me aroundd here.
[/quote]
So what do you 'suggest' in terms of moderation Ed? Common sense suggestions outside the usual no-threatening behaviour or porn, or any of the other stuff we can all agree on.
Where do you draw the line as to what is not acceptable for all? Free speech, non-inclusiveness, off-topic, shackling the First Amendment, etc..etc..?
[/quote]
I did not suggest any specific rules, any kind of code of conduct, or any censorship or deprivation of free speech. I do not care about going off-topic because in real in-person conversations, sometimes folks will drift into othere related issues or any kind of friendly chat. On many forums and threads, including some of the ones I read HERE in this new forum, dethorate into verbal combat t, and behavior that would not be tolerated in most civil human relationships. The entire value of the thread is destroyed in the chaos.
At the end of the day, the founder and managers will determine the policies. My operative words would be mutual respect, patience, and a bit of kindness. Persona attacks should be prohibited and removed- is that draconian, unconstitutional, or absurd?
As I alluded to in a prior post, you have no idea as to who I am, where I came from, and waht kind of life I have led. I can tell you that I am no wallflower and have dealt with growing up in a very tough neighborhood, serving 2- tours in the Vietnam War and dealing with all kidsof bullies, and reprobates. This did not manifest in my being a tough guy or a hard-ass. I have become super appreciative of peace and cordial behavior.
I have been a professional photographer for nearly 60 years and still working. I learned a lot about photography "on the street" and was fortunate enough to have a decent formal education in technology. I have benefited from the advice of many generous mentors and teachers. Officially,l as an old man with a gray beard, befor I head off the graveyard, I would like to share what I have learned over the years and learn someof the new stuff along the way. I just don't want to do that in a hostile and unfriendly environment.
The business of photography can be a kind of rough racket. It's highly competitive in some geographic locations, and in a day's work, there can be many hurdles to jump over. We need to deal with art directors, clients, suppliers, models, security folks, and all kinds of people and personalities. We have to get into places where photogahy may be restricted, seek out cooperation, work with a team spirit, sell and promote our services, and run a business. Believe me- multi-tasking is overrated! In so many of these instances "people-skills" almost trump technical savvy. One basic rule and philosophy I go by is that people do not want to deal with folks they don't like, let alone pay them their hard-earned money.
I am no longer operating in a war zone so in my spare time, I don't want to deal with rough stuff anymore or have to put up with excessive nonsense. If this is perceived as selfish or overly tempermental- well, so be it!
If suggesting some common-sense moderation is too much of an ask, please accept my apologies. I just realized this is not the place for me.
Regarding the latest update, "Photo Equipment try 2". Minor, but the Micro 4/3 should be called Micro 4/3 & 4/3 to be inclusive of the prior DSLR models like Full Frame or APS C & H are to their type.
That said, I lean towards the using brands for the gear. I may not be interested in say, Sony, but I might end up opening posts in a FF forum about Sony that I am not interested in because the title is not specific enough to tell me what it is about. If grouped by brand, then I would dip into the forums for the brands I own and not the others, unless I was considering a change.
Arvo has come up with a combination of brand and non-branded forums for us to look at. I've added them into the dev2 site as 'Photo Equipment Try 3'. Have a look.
I'm going to put up a poll in a few minutes (new thread) so you can choose what you want. Let's see if there's an overwhelming desire for one of the three.
